User talk:Doulomb
Hi, welcome to the ! Thanks for your edit to the Template:GameNav page. Please leave a message on my talk page if I can help with anything! Bluerock (talk) 22:01, July 10, 2015 (UTC) :Just so both of you are aware, I posted a link to a Tumblr post that elaborated a bit on what Kojima was trying to convey via Portable Ops's stance in canon and why it's frequently excluded, Rising as well. Hopefully, that will quell most of the canon fight that's going on regarding those two games. The post is here: http://solidkenny87.tumblr.com/post/97125545680/clearer-translation-of-kojimas-mpo-answer Weedle McHairybug (talk) 17:54, July 11, 2015 (UTC) :Here is what I wrote explaining my stance to someone else. :That information is outdated. As we've drawn closer to the release of The Phantom Pain, series creator Hideo Kojima has released a great deal of information that has superseded the sources you've given. To make it clear, the games that are canon are MG, MG2, MGS1 - V as well as Peace Walker. I'll call these the "Core8" for clarity. Firstly, Konami released this image in the last year detailing the Metal Gear Saga timeline. Notice that it only contains the Core8 games. Secondly there is this newer interview from 2015 with Kojima where he says the following: "I always say 'this will be my last Metal Gear,'" Kojima said, "but the games in the series that I've personally designed and produced -- Metal Gear on MSX, MG2, MGS1, 2, 3, 4, Peace Walker, and now MGSV -- are what constitute a single 'Metal Gear Saga.' With MGSV, I'm finally closing the loop on that saga." : Once again he refers to the Metal Gear saga of canon games as consisting of the Core8. I can't think of anything more explicit than this. I'd love to hear any response you have to this, but I think this new information takes precedence. Doulomb (talk) 18:00, July 11, 2015 (UTC) : : : ::That Tumblr post was NOT outdated, actually. It was made just within this year. And besides which, the timelines were also made in 2012-2013, and I might as well remind you that MGS4 and Peace Walker both acknowledged Portable Ops directly and within the story in a way that wasn't a fourth wall break (well, okay, maybe a slight fourth wall break in the case of one of the references in MGS4). Weedle McHairybug (talk) 21:13, September 6, 2015 (UTC) So what was the significance of Miller mentioning San Hieronymo. Miller wasn't even involved and MSF was located in Baranquilla. I really didn't understand what he meant by "leaving that crap behind." Was what he said canon or just breaking the 4th wall? -- 21:07, September 6, 2015 (UTC) :Definitely not a fourth wall break. If it was a fourth wall break, it would have been a bit more direct, like using the title of the game instead of just the game's setting. Not to mention, it's not the first time Miller acknowledged stuff he wasn't personally present for, since he also referenced stuff from Snake Eater as well (the bit about Big Boss being experienced with the Fulton, as well as talking about Snake's time in FOXHOUND and FOX). Weedle McHairybug (talk) 21:11, September 6, 2015 (UTC) :Not a 4th wall break. This is just more proof that the events shown in Portable Ops were not valid/canonical and take place in an alternate universe. Since we are 100% certain that Peace Walker is canon, then we must take its version of events as being more accurate. SInce Miller mentions the San Hieronymo incident this means that he was involved in it to a prominent degree. :''However ''this is where the cotnradiction lies. Miller does not appear at all in Portable Ops which means that there is a contradiction between the PW version and the PoOps version. Since PW is more accurate (Kojima wrote and directed it, rather than just produced it), then we must acknowledge that the Portable Ops telling of events is faulty and non-canon. :Therefore we now know the following: :*Portable Ops contradicts canon game Peace Walker's version of events :*PoOps is either non-canon or alternate timeline :*In the canon timeline there was a San Hieronymo Incident and Miller was involved in it. I would guess that this is Kojima's way of retconning Portable Ops story into oblivion. He clearly has disdain for the story anyways because throug Kaz he refers to it as "crap". Anyways hope this clears things up! Doulomb (talk) 22:32, September 6, 2015 (UTC) ::Thanks Doulomb. It's a shame that canonically Sokolov did not survive Volgin's beating and therefore was never reunited with his family. :( Sokolov surviving was the best part of Portable Ops. Good luck with your edit war with Weedle. Hopefully Bluerock will do something about him soon.. Then again, the story wasn't even written by a member of Konami unlike Rising. Good luck with your edit war with Weedle. Hopefully Bluerock will do something about him soon and fix all of the Portable Ops and Rising articles. Also, one more question, since the "deviously cunning strategist" doesn't exist, what did EVA mean when she said that the CIA eliminated The Boss because they feared her charisma? I thought they had no clue Volgin would use the nuke. Please reply when you have time. -- 13:49, September 7, 2015 (UTC) ::::Thank you! Its nice to know that someone else is on my side with this one. Hopefully Bluerock can deal with it so that the non-trolls on this website can actually contribute good information and make sure the wiki portrays the most up to date version of the facts. Regarding the CIA eliminating The Boss, I think that the CIA is really a standin for the American Philosophers who were worried about her charisma being a threat to their existence. That said they didn't actually plan for her to die ahead of time but when Volgin used the nuke they decided to kill 2 birds with one stone and get rid of The Boss. Thats just my take on it though. Let me know if I left anything unlcear. :D Doulomb (talk) 16:57, September 7, 2015 (UTC) :::No, if Kojima wanted to make a statement about MPO, especially retconning it into oblivion, he would have done it directly to make clear that it was a fourth wall break. Has anyone forgotten about how several of Miller's calls in MG2 and MGS explicitly referenced the fact that the player was playing a game? Do something like that. And anyways, how do you explain the presence of stills from Portable Ops in Ocelot's history lecture if it was non-canon, or it's presence in the MGS4 Database. And just because Miller referenced MPO in terms of story doesn't mean he was breaking the fourth wall. Have both of you completely forgotten that this was the same game that had Miller explicitly reference Snake Eater a few times despite his also not being present for the events as well? Weedle McHairybug (talk) 13:52, September 7, 2015 (UTC)